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A glamping owner’s revelation after 10 years operating, Episode #059

After 10 years in the glamping industry, this is one owner's revelation

Always take the time to hunt out the experts and speak with those who are generous enough to share their expertise in the industry. Especially when they have been working within it for so many years. This is why I was happy to welcome Phil Russell from Tor View Shepherds Huts in Somerset onto the show.

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In this episode, Phil shares his insights into the industry and the typical glamping guest. He also talks about the thing that surprises him the most about some guests that stay with him. Having been in business for 10 years now, he discusses the top things that have led to his success and how his determination was key. He also talks about maintaining his team and how he has built it to support him where he needs it most. Phil finally shares what he would do first if he was starting from scratch again and how having a seasonal lifestyle business really works with his personal passion to travel.

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Sarah Riley: Always pay attention to the experts and seek advice from those who have been in the industry for years. And that’s exactly why I invited Phil Russell onto the show, as he has been in this industry for so many years, running his Shepherd’s Hut business in one of my favorite places in the uk. Here’s what we would call a dab hand, a font of knowledge, an expert, and an authority on glamping. Welcome to episode 59.

Sarah Riley: Glamping and unique holiday rentals are surging in popularity with the growing desire of customers to book holidays that deliver an experience. They are also the new business of choice for those wanting to improve their work life balance. So how do you build a strong business like this that gives you the life you need and a great investment I’m Sarah Reilly, and I want to share what I’ve discovered after being immersed in this industry for over 20 years to inspire you to find out more about what’s going on. Welcome. This is the business of glamping and unique holiday rentals.

Sarah Riley: Phil, thank you so much for joining me today. It’s fantastic to have somebody who has so many years of running a business in the glamping industry and has such a huge amount of knowledge of what you know it actually takes to run a business. So you are a great resource to me and to others. And so actually having you on the show is fantastic. So welcome here today, Phil.

Phil Russell: Morning, Sarah

Sarah Riley: Morning indeed. So tell me a little bit about where you are and what’s so special about your location.

Phil Russell: Well, we are located in England, in the county of Somerset. And, we are on one of the highest, elevations in the Somerset Hills, in the Mendip Hills, overlooking Glastonbury tour. as the, as the crow flies, it’s probably about seven or eight miles away, and with, stunning views for 30 miles to the, the QuantX and, and down to the Bristol Channel. So yeah, a very privileged location.

Sarah Riley: It really is. And I’ve actually spent many, many years there because I used to go to college in that general area, and I know it incredibly well, so I know how beautiful it is. But for somebody who’s never visited the area, tell them what the tour is and why it’s so special.

Phil Russell: Well bury there is, there’s many myths to it, but, it goes back hundreds of years. And King Arthur is, allegedly, renowned of, being there at some stage. And, nowadays, it’s used for walking up, obviously. and also, you know, the locals and, you know, the Druids, they, they, they celebrate, summer Soltice. I was there the summer saucers myself this year. And they will, also be there for the winter saucers, which is not many days away from there.

Sarah Riley: Mm-hmm. It is, I know from my only time in the area that the tour, it’s, it’s on a huge hill. It, which it’s not really hill,

Phil Russell: It’s mound. It’s a, it’s a big ma, it’s a big mound. Yes.

Sarah Riley: So is this a natural mound, you know, calved from glacier movement, or is this something that’s slightly manmade

Phil Russell: The honest answer is, I don’t really know, but I’m sure it’s not manmade.

Sarah Riley: Yeah. But the tour, I know that many people come from around the world to visit it. It’s just got a huge amount of myth, as you say, legend. but particularly people talk about the fact that the Holy grail is buried in that area as well. So all of these things. Do you, do you get visitors who come and stay with you Do they specifically stay with you to go and visit the tour

Phil Russell: We get, visitors that sometimes don’t know it’s there. and they will often say, oh, vast, can I, I’ve actually had one guest say, can I walk to the tour And I did actually point out that, you know, the distance it was so, it, it looks nearby, but, as I said, it’s a few miles as a crow flies. generally speaking, people that want to visit the tour, will probably be staying Glastonbury itself, because they want to be very much connected to the Lelands and, and, and that, that buzz and that environment of Glastonbury, it’s a very special and unique and different type of town. It’s, I describe it, to my guests. It’s the, the street, the high street you walk down where you don’t want to buy a tinner paint and a paintbrush, cuz you’re not gonna find it. But if you wanna buy some crystals, you’re gonna find lots of them. so yeah, glamy is a, a weird and wonderful town. but people obviously can sit outside the hut here and they can see the tour quite clearly.

Sarah Riley: Yeah, yeah. And it’s really stunning on the, quite flat. Is it part of the Somerset levels where you are

Phil Russell: No, no, no. We’re on, we’re very high up here. As I said, we’re one of the highest points, in Somerset. The Somerset levels are quite low at this present moment. I can see them from our, our home here. And they, they are underwater as we speak.

Sarah Riley: right. Because of the rain that we’ve had recently. Well, the, that’s its natural way, isn’t it, as well being underwater. Yes. Yeah. But, yeah, so anyway, so the area that you’re living in is, you’ve got Glastonbury Festival, which is this huge renowned, world renowned festival that happens in the area. You’ve got the tour, you’ve got the Mend of Hills, you’ve got so many other things around you. And what would you say is probably your guess most common reason for visiting Is it, is it to rest and recuperate or is it to actually have a look around or hike, or what is it that they usually come and stay with you for

Phil Russell: That’s a good question. That’s a very good question. And sometimes, I will answer your, your question, but I always go around the, around the road to just look at this one. Typically, you know, a guest was stapled two to three nights and you would like them to take advantage of the exceptional area and beauty that we have here. But it does surprise me with some guests that they do arrive and, not that we necessarily engage with the customers, unless they want us to, or we, we see them. But when I do talk to ’em, I do scratch my head slightly when they’ve say, driven from London down here for three hours. And I might just see them, as they’re walking past and they say up to anything nice day, and they say, we’re going shopping in Bath or Bristol .

Phil Russell: And I do , I do scratch my head with that one slightly. I’ve had some gus some customers that stay here for, you know, up to a week almost, and never move. Wow. They literally pop park the car up and never move. And I, I, I think the ideal thing is, if you came here for two or three nights, is a, a typical stay is to come here to the area, go visit, say Glastonbury tour in the morning before the check-in, come to the huts, enjoy a couple of days mm-hmm. , you could pop out to let’s say Glastonbury or Wells, you know, the smaller city in England, for a few hours to get some provisions or have a look at the cathedral and then come back and enjoy the environment and the air we’ve got here. And then when you check out, maybe go to another town on your way home. But, everyone comes to different reasons, but I would like to think if people come and stay, they should enjoy the huts and the environment. Mm-hmm.

Sarah Riley:  Yeah. Certainly I’ve seen from your social media, some of the people that have stayed and they shared their personal pitches and, and everything else of them staying in your huts. And it looks idyllic because there’s so much greenery around them. There’s so much space. And, and many of them take photographs inside your, Swedish. Are they Swedish hot tubs Hot hot bars They are

Phil Russell: yes. Yes, yes,

Sarah Riley: Yes. And, and so clearly they’re loving it and enjoying it. And I suppose if you’ve come from the city and you don’t often have that kind of environment and space and nature around you, then it’s, it’s just stunning. And no wonder they don’t wanna leave. Yeah, exactly. Indeed.

Phil Russell: Just, yeah.

Sarah Riley:  Yeah. Yeah. So how many years have you been running your business now

Phil Russell: Well, as of, next year it will be our 10th anniversary. It’ll be Wow. yeah, so 10 years. next Mate will be our 10th anniversary.

Sarah Riley:  Oh, well congratulations for that. That’s f that’s really fantastic. Should

Phil Russell: I get a cup

Sarah Riley: We’ll give you some kind of an award, Phil, don’t you, Rory. But I think, you know, it’s safe to say it can be quite challenging in hospitality. I mean, I’ve been in my own business, not anymore in hospitality, but I did, jointly run a business for 10 years. And it’s really challenging, at times. Although obviously there’s some really upsides to it as well. And we’ll talk about that in a minute. of course. But, but of the things that you, you know, that have worked and haven’t worked, what would you say are some of the top things that have led to your success and for keeping going so well for so long

Phil Russell: That’s a good question. Probably been stubborn, determined that very much helps and, and, and wanting it to be a success. cuz it has to be a success. Yeah. I, you know, as I speak to you now, I’m, I’m in my office overlooking the hus and when I started on the project, which was like 11 years ago, there, there wasn’t many people out there in the glamping industry. Not many were Shepherd Hus, you know, and I was gonna provide an en-suite Shepherd Uck, which is . There was ba basically none of them in the uk. we, we were building it on site. Mm. I had no budget. I didn’t have any money, I didn’t think. All I did was kept buying and spending. And, my accounts lady was here just going through a carrier bag of receipts. And she said to me, do you know how much you spent

Phil Russell: And with the figure she gave me, I fell off the chair, couldn’t believe how much I’d spent. I won’t do how much it was, but I think I should have bought a Range Rover instead . And, I realized then that I’d spent so much money, it had to be a success. So Yeah. Determination, you know Mm-hmm. and resignation, you know, I think many, as you said earlier, all businesses are hard to run, you know, and I do remember actually having a conversation with a guest and he, he took, like Terry, he said, he said, you’ve got a good lifestyle. He said, you know, I’ve worked out, you know, these huts, they only cost you X, Y, z. You charge this, you know, you must be making that. And I said, never guess how much that hut is insured for. And he was gobsmack when I told him the price. So, you know, it’s all very easy for us to look at any business, not necessary glamping, and think that’s an easy job. You know, I remember, you know, when I’d go to the pub, potentially an underage stringer at the time, and, , it was always nice to be, you know, on this side of the bar, but I never wanted to work the other side because I knew there were so many hours to be working and it was a hard life. So it’s the same with any business, I’d say.

Sarah Riley: Mm-hmm. Absolutely. And I think as well, we’ve, we’ve had conversations in the past where, you know, you’ve said, I might have been running my business for 10 years, but that’s, that’s needed. Constant annual updates. Everything needs to be upgraded and changed. Oh, yes.

Phil Russell: So that it’s really, yes, it don’t

Sarah Riley: Stop. Exactly. So the spending doesn’t stop the, the maintaining. It doesn’t stop you. You can’t run a five star business and allow it to go down to four star. It’s got to be maintained to a five star business. And that’s exactly h what we e experienced when we were running a five-star business. And it can be quite challenging to keep those standards as high as you want them to be. so what would you say was the most important thing to aim for when trying to continue your success that you’ve had so far Is it working on your online presence Is it working on the facilities you’re offering your guests Is it doing your social media What, what would you say for you has been, most important when trying to continue your success

Phil Russell: Well, I think all the elements, are important. but what you probably have to is establishes who can do what. You know, there’s only one of me, I can’t spin every plate, so I’m pretty good hands-on, you know, with regards to the actual huts in the environment, you know, I set the standard that, you know, I would expect, you know, at least with my standard and for my guests, you know, the marketing, while I have a, an understanding of that, I probably need to, rely on other people’s services to, ensure that we, portray the, the correct type of, social media and what we should be promoting. so yeah, I, I have to use resources. I can’t do it all myself.

Sarah Riley: And you’ve actually, one of the things that I’ve noticed from working with you is that you have got a team. Yes. So you’ve decided that you need a team. Yes. How did you, how did that come together This team who, who you, did you decide that Or has it naturally evolved

Phil Russell: well, obviously in my previous, work in practices, which was in tech communications, telecommunications, again, we had, you know, it, we had marketing departments, we had consultants. So it, it wasn’t as if I wasn’t aware of what these other persons were, let’s say. And probably 10 years ago, I was slightly naive, you know, maybe I did think I could do it all myself. And what I found was that once I’d spent all this money and realized this was not a lifestyle, this was, I need to make this pay. And I was very naive and I thought they will come. And, you know, we, we promoted the product and unfortunately they did not come. People didn’t arrive. And I started to worry and I thought, what have I done wrong here So I sought advice from friends and consultants and, you know, you know, I started employing people’s services to help build, our, our brand and our products.

Sarah Riley: Kevin Costner’s got a lot to answer for, and he said, if you build it, they will come. No

Phil Russell: they didn’t come. They didn’t come.

Sarah Riley: That’s not the way it works. And, and actually it’s interesting cuz so many other people I I’ve worked with in the past, or I’ve spoken to, and, and they’ve said that they’ve put so much passion into building their actual service, the structures and what people will be sleeping in and ha you know, enjoying while they’re staying there. And they put very little time into thinking about their marketing and where they were actually going to get their guests from. And I think maybe things have got much more competitive. Would you agree from the time that you started to now

Phil Russell: Totally. But there, there’s two points there. And you know, you know, I’ve been approached in the last 10 years from, other persons that have directly said to me, you know, they want to set up a ground in business. And for those that have been a bit speaky and haven’t told me, but I know what they want to do. And we as humans, we will always do the easiest jobs or the jobs we like first. Mm-hmm. . So you touched upon the point where somebody will create their space, they’ll build it. Yes. They will build it because they enjoy that and they can do that. What they can’t do is the latter, which normally is, which involves it technology, marketing, and social media. So I, I think there’s a reasonable pattern of that with people setting up businesses that, you know, yes, we can build something, or yes, we can buy this and sell it, but they don’t necessarily think about the backend. And the backend of, of a business, as I’ve, found out for yourself is is quite, quite a complicated backend system, as they say.

Sarah Riley: Hmm, absolutely. And, and for those who are listening, who are thinking backend, backend, what does that mean

Phil Russell: I’m sorry,

Sarah Riley: Safe to say it’s what’s going on behind the scenes that guest customers can’t see So the front end is obviously the shop window for what people can see online, but also what people can see when they come and visit your actual accommodation backend being what they can’t see. And, and so I suppose what you are saying is that you are, discovering a lot more about what’s happening in the backend. Is that, is that what you’re saying

Phil Russell: Yes, yes. Yes. Yeah. I mean, I I I haven’t really necessarily had to pay too much. Sorry. Maybe I should have paid more attention to the, the backend, let’s say. But it’s only recently that, I’m spending more time looking at and reviewing that.

Sarah Riley: Yeah. Which actually is, I, I think is a really, you know, a huge applause to you really, because you have been in this business for a really long time, and sometimes people can get complacent and think that they know it all because they have been operating a successful business for, for so long. But you are very much saying, no, I want to learn more. I want to know what’s going on. You know, this industry is evolving. Is, would you, you know, would you agree with my

Phil Russell: Yes. Same, same with any industry. Industry, you know, I mean, if we go back 20 years ago, we’ll still send in faxes to each other. Mm-hmm. , I mean, there could, there could be some people that listen to this podcast and don’t even know what a fax is. Yeah. , now, you know, we’re, we’re sending WhatsApps, you know Yeah,

Sarah Riley: Yeah. Absolutely. And I think the industry is changing so much, and that’s why it’s really good to have a bird’s eye view of what’s working, what’s not working, and to keep an eye, particularly on what the hotels are doing. Because if the hotels start doing something, then people start expecting it a bit more in other accommodations. That’s quite interesting. so this is something that I try to keep my finger on the pulse with. so a lot of people do feel very much like when they’re building their business, they feel like it’s their baby, they they’ve grown. Yeah.

Phil Russell: Correct. Yeah. Fully relate to that.

Sarah Riley: And so how did you overcome that feeling of, you were, when you were bringing your team in, when you were starting to work with that team, how did you overcome having to hand over parts of your, what you’ve grown, what you’ve given birth trust into somebody

Phil Russell: Else It’s trust. Mm-hmm. Pure trust. I still, I, I still think of them, you know, talking more about the front end, you know, Len and Ted, that’s the names of the huts that we have here. You know, some people sort of like disabled, which ones, which one’s your favorite And it was, it’s a bit like, you can’t say which one’s your favorite kid. . So that’s, so there, there is that emotional bond to that. But, my, my marketing, team, I fully trust worked with them for many, many years, you know, and they, they know how I tick and I, I, I really let them, you know, give ’em an outline brief and they, they get on and go and do it. And, it’s very rare that I might say not sure about that. you know, and the same with the it, you know, the IT company, I trust ’em applicably, nine times outta 10. They do everything as it needs to be done.

Sarah Riley: Having experienced it, I think as well, you know, you do a huge amount of due diligence before you actually enter into something with somebody else. And, and, and so I think you are saying that you trust, but you do that background check, you do that,

Phil Russell: You know Oh, yes. I mean, you know, you wouldn’t, you know, I’m very privileged that I’ve got my own builders that, but if for instance, you move to a new location and you want to have some building work done, you wouldn’t just open up the, the yellow pages don’t even exist anymore now. But, you know, pick a builder, you’d go for recommendations. you wanna see their work, you wanna find out information. so yeah. You need, you need to do checks. Definitely. So,

Sarah Riley:  So if you were starting from scratch today. Yes. So you say you were starting all over again, with a new business, what would you do first to aim for the same kind of success that you’ve currently got

Phil Russell: This is, I’ve always said this to anyone that’s asked me that question before you buy anything. Yeah. Go and stay three different locations of something similar that you want to provide, invest, you know, a thousand pounds and go and stay two or three nights, you know, whether it’s a wig, wham, a shepherd’s up tent, caravan, a bus, whatever it may be. And do, and do your research and think, you know, and, and look at it and walk away from it. And then think, do you really want to be doing that You know And, and try and gain some information from where you’re stand. You will gain a lot of information directly or indirectly with the owner. I’ve done it myself. I, I’ve stayed in a number of, other persons, shepherd Hus, and that’s right. I gained my, obsession at the time.

Phil Russell: But I do think people look at this industry as a lifestyle industry and think, you know, oh, that’s easy, isn’t it All you gotta do is make a few beds mm-hmm. Put it on the internet, you know, sell it for X pounds, and they’re making a lot of money. Well, unfortunately, it doesn’t necessarily work that way. You know, all costs are going up, running costs, nothing seems to be going down in price. so yeah, it’s definitely a lifestyle business. Can you, can you get a salary from it Mm-hmm. You, you need, you need to, you need to reward yourself somehow. Mm-hmm. But, you know, the price that you might get in August, the price, then maybe you get in January, nor the demand, and, you know, will it be suffice That’s, you know, is it gonna be a part-time job You know, it’s

Sarah Riley: Who knows So really, so really, I suppose picking that apart a little bit, what you are saying is for somebody to really do a bit of research about what they personally want out of it and what they can personally get out of it, if they run a certain style of a glamping business model, I suppose. So it’s about, look at the different models out there, see which one suits you best, and then look at, you know, maybe the cash flow and everything else Yeah. And see whether you are going to be able to make the money that you want out of it Yeah. To have the lifestyle that you

Phil Russell: Want. I mean, I mean, somebody might have the view that in, you know, I mean, I’ve been to a number of, of camping shows in the past and let’s say a tent arguments like, yes. You know, I steered away from, camps and tents. I, I don’t know much about ’em at all, but it’s a fabric, you know, I don’t think it’s gonna last long and, you know, and the weather is gonna deteriorate with it. My understanding is, you know, a setup with that is far more cost effective, than let’s say a structure, a cabin, let’s say. So your, your setup costs are far less, but, you know, in two or three years time, I think you’re probably replacing most of it again. Mm-hmm. so everything’s a double-edged sword. You know, do you start off with a small outlay, for smaller returns, or do you go for a big capital outlay for a longer term longevity Mm-hmm. for a slower returns, you know Mm-hmm. And everyone’s different. I still say the same thing, you know, whether it’s a tent or a cabin, do your research. Go and stay in your potential competitors units, look at it, make notes, and then go away and think, can we do better Mm-hmm. ,

Sarah Riley:  I th I think as well, it’s worth mentioning there, which, what you touched on as well, which is about, you know, if you are looking at things like, canvas structures, they, they might be cheaper and easier to set up at the beginning, but as you say, there’s different maintenance issues. It may not suit your land topography or, you know, the weather that you get hit by on that land. And also, you don’t actually have something that you can sell at the end of it if you decide that you don’t want to run your business anymore. And whereas actually when you have something like a cabin or shepherd huts, it’s actually an asset. It’s got a capital Yeah. You know, value to it so you can actually sell it. And so that is, is an added benefit, I suppose, even though the outlay is greater. But it is interesting because I’ve been hearing recently, people saying that they’ve been advised, don’t do your business plan. Don’t think about that. Just get up, get up and do it. Just, just do it. Just get on with it. Otherwise you’ll procrastinate. You’ll never get it done.

Phil Russell: You’ve met me then. ,

Sarah Riley: maybe that was Phil 10 years ago. Yes. But what I’m getting at the moment is Phil, today is slightly different and is more along my lines, which is, yeah, I totally agree that a full business plan is unnecessary. If you’re not going out for investment to investors, you don’t need the narrative side of it. But what you do need to do, at the very least, is to understand the, the numbers, the, you know, what money you gonna make, what you gonna spend, how much is that gonna be for you Is that gonna fit within your life and what you want out of it And, and how, you know, will that help you move forward in terms of your lifestyle And I think that’s something that you’ve really got, right. The Phil today has really got this bit right, is about running your business, but also running it as a way of having a lifestyle. tell me a little bit about that

Phil Russell: Oh, well, when I, when I was much younger, when I was at school, I wanted to, I wanted to be a policeman, I think, but I couldn’t because I’m colorblind. And so I felt the test, but I seemed to a young age, I, I seem to like travel and I probably could have been a, a travel writer or worked in a travel agent, but that, that never happened, let’s say. And, I, I do like to self-educate myself, and I like, I do like to travel. And, as you, you probably do know sir, we’ve had a couple of conversations in the last few weeks. I do get around a little bit

Phil Russell: Especially in the winter period, you know Mm-hmm. One thing, you know, if somebody does set up a business like this, you know, I’ve got a pretty good idea of when I’m gonna be busy or, you know, in this, in the peak time period, I should know when I’m gonna be slack. Mm-hmm. You know, and as opposed to, you know, have my arms crossed in November, you know, thinking, am I gonna sell a midweek, stay now Mm-hmm. Well, it’s probably unlikely. So instead of me waiting for something to happen, I go and do something. So typically I will go away for, you know, two or three nights, into Europe somewhere and do some traveling. Mm-hmm. But I don’t try to let it jeopardize the business. Mm-hmm. So, I, I’ll always come back, to, maintain the, the hu

Sarah Riley:  Yeah. Well, so it was quite interesting cuz it actually feeds into a conversation that had with someone, not very long ago, part of my my own glamping network that I’ve got. Yeah. and, and they were saying that even though they did have, with the re with the, the units they had, they could have continued to operate them all year round, but they chose not

Phil Russell: To, decided not to. Yeah,

Sarah Riley:  Yeah, yeah. They chose to close their doors over a period of time because for them lifestyle, having that downtime and being able to pursue their passions was really important to them. And I completely understand that. And that’s exactly what you are saying, isn’t it That it’s really, it really suits you having a seasonal business cuz then you can travel.

Phil Russell: Yeah. I mean, on a personal level, you know, the month of January we, we tend to shut the doors. we, we do, the majority of our bigger maintenance in January. And then, well my, my myself and my wife are going on a cruise in, in January, next year. and that’s our, that’s our major holiday when you can just not even cover to look at the, the phone or the emails or worry about any issues about home. Cause we’re quiet. yes. Yeah.

Sarah Riley: Completely switch off and enjoy your relaxation time knowing that you are coming back to a business that will still be able to restart, relaunch, you know, have guests come in the door when you are ready to open again. And I think that for me is what makes this industry so exciting is the fact that it can fit around your wants and needs out of life rather than the other way around. yeah. Yeah.

Phil Russell: Well, well obviously most people are probably gonna be self-employed in this, this industry as well. And, without going into too much detail and, may not be the most financial, best move in the world, but, you know, if you had a nine to five job in the city, you know, with, demanding, targets and achievements, you know, you, you’re gonna earn a lot more money there. But with this, it’s a, normally it’s a more slower pace of life. It’s a different way of life. But, you know, we don’t, I don’t travel abroad in the summer, you know, why do I need to, you know, normally the weather in the UK is pretty good then. Mm-hmm. And also like glassy festival, cause I do Stewart there, every year.

Sarah Riley: Exactly. I mean, bury Festival is just a, another example of lifestyle, isn’t it, . So people choosing to do certain things that they love doing and, and yes. Putting themselves and that, those activities first. Yeah. Well, you’re an inspiration, Phil, because not only have you been running something in this industry for so long, you have been able to, you know, choose to, to mold it around your lifestyle needs and, and what you want to achieve out of life.

Phil Russell: Not, I’m not getting younger nowadays, so I need to, I need to broaden my horizons.

Sarah Riley:  I love that. What’s your, what’s your, favorite place to visit

Phil Russell: It’s probably gonna be, Spain and the RICS for two reasons. One, it’s very convenient for me to get to from here, from Bristol Airport. I must improve my Spanish. It’s not good enough. I’ve been on a couple of courses I would describe myself as, I would never go without a drink of food in a bar in Spain. , yeah. So I, I do and I do like to go abroad, you know, and not necessarily be with other English people, let’s say. You know, it’s just nice to hear different voices.

Sarah Riley: Yeah, absolutely. What’s the point in traveling to another country if you’re just gonna hang out eating, you know, English food with English people you no. To enjoy. No. Well, that country has to offer. Absolutely. Oh, well, it’s been a, it is been a pleasure speaking with you today, Phil. And I wish you the best luck on your travels and I’m incredibly envious of, you getting some winter sun and

Phil Russell: I’ll send you a postcard.

Sarah Riley: No, please do and I look forward very much to catching up with you when you return.

Phil Russell: Thank you,

Sarah Riley: Sarah. Thank you indeed. Speak to you soon. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Thanks again to Phil from Tour View Shepherd Hutz. Now if you want to go and have a look at his website, have a look at his location and even book a holiday Booker stay, as he was saying, you can learn so much from staying in other people’s glamping businesses, then all you need to do is go to tour view shepherd uk. If you found Phil’s insights on this industry helpful, then I would love your review. Just leave it in the review column. Beth, any podcasting platform you are listening to this episode on, I’d love to have your thoughts and come back here again as I’ve got some fantastic content lined up for you. Hope you can join me here again soon. Bye-bye.

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